This bit right here where Odin plays the “The only reason you were ever something was because of me, by yourself you are nothing“ card is what he is actually about in regards to Loki (I’m side-eyeing everyone in the comments acting like it’s okay to say this kind of abusive shit to anyone and those who are ignoring the fact that Odin was the one who instilled that “born to be king” crap in Loki in the first place). Here he is practically relishing in telling Loki how unwanted he was and how he was always nothing.
He doesn’t really give a damn that Loki doesn’t value human life (he himself doesn’t) and he himself didn’t view the supposed annihilation of a whole race (Dark Elves) as a tragedy.
Odin is just pissed that Loki acted out of “his place”.
So glad at least Thor called him out on his hypocrisy later in the movie.
//GOD BLESS YOU FOREVER yes yes YES
I wrote so much meta on this when TDW came out, but primarily, if you think it’s alright to tell your own child that he should be grateful that you didn’t let him die as an infant, you’re the problem. YOU.
If you want to call Odin a good ruler, fine, that’s DEBATABLE at least. A good father? Please.
What a load of hot cock.
Seriously? Odin jumps down Loki’s throat with the ‘your birthright’ shit because Loki just tried justifying breaking not one (Jotunheim) but two (Earth!) peace treaties/laws that Odin had set in place before Loki had even spoken his first words. Yet inside two (at most!) years, Loki fucked up two of the nine realms. Three, if you include the shitfest Asgard would have been thrown into trying to contain the damage he wrought. Loki did it all, knowing, knowing inside out that Odin was never going to approve—but he believed it his birthright. Why? Because Loki, for all that we love his sharp tongue and his bullshit and issues—is the unreliable narrator of his own life. Cut me down if this shit isn’t true, seriously.
Odin? No, not a great dad. But can he seriously be a dad in this scene when Loki has committed treason? Genocide? Attempted mass slavery of a peaceful planet that wasn’t even remotely prepared for war? No, in that case Odin had to be a king. And kings don’t tell their goddamn hard-fought and captured prisoners they were owed any sort of birthright relating to outright murder and slavery. As for the (Dark Elves) part, remember that was long before Odin. That was Bor, his father—and that was another war.
How about—for a novel idea—we stop blaming Odin for all of Loki’s shortcomings? Because if Odin was half as shit a dad as we all want to believe, where the mouldy ass was Frigga during Loki’s upbringing? And how in god’s name did Thor come out okay?
Odin isn’t perfect. Not even close. But slapping abuse labels on him, expecting the soft compassion of a bleeding heart from the king of a warrior race, and expecting him to hug it out with his criminal son (sorry, did we forget the part where he also summarily disowned and kicked Thor off the entire planet without his powers for doing similar, where he would still remain if Loki hadn’t set him up to die) and then treating Odin like he’s some kind of demon? No. No, how about we let Loki own his crimes and then work upward from there.
Because frankly, yes. Loki’s birthright was to die. We all read the deleted lines from the script, didn’t we? Laufey’s abandoned bastard. Picked up by Odin. A political tool? Sure. But the only reason Odin adopted the son of his former enemy as his own? Hardly. Odin could have Jon Snow’d that baby. Kings don’t often make sons of their war trophies. If Loki had a single moment of clarity, he might have realised that—and maybe the entire Thor MCU series would never have actually taken place.
In short, Odin ain’t your goddamn scapegoat for characterisation justification. Not in the MCU. He didn’t even get the damn on-screen chance to be the kind of bastard that could forge Loki.
“Where the mouldy ass was Frigga” just ripped an insane laugh out of my body
^^
Umm….nobody blamed Odin for all of Loki’s problems. Literally no one said that. They just said he wasn’t that great at the dad thing. (And if the best thing a parent can say is that ‘at least i didn’t let you die!’ then I’m not sure how much of an argument there really is. To be fair, it’s still more of an argument than Laufey would be able to make.)
you may want to take a look at icyxmischief’s meta, because she writes a LOT examining Loki’s actions and motivations, and it’s actually pretty fair and balanced.
Lol okay. I feel like there’s a lack of critical thinking going on here and it’s a little vicariously embarrassing.
“Seriously? Odin jumps down Loki’s throat with the ‘your birthright’ shit because Loki just tried justifying breaking not one (Jotunheim) but two (Earth!) peace treaties/laws that Odin had set in place before Loki had even spoken his first words. Yet inside two (at most!) years, Loki fucked up two of the nine realms. Three, if you include the shitfest Asgard would have been thrown into trying to contain the damage he wrought.”
Okay, like, did you miss the first half of ‘Thor’ entirely? Like maybe the part where Thor disintegrates the peace treaty with Jotunheim? Because by the time Loki took any action against Jotunheim other than tagging along with Thor (and if we’re counting that, better throw in the W4 and Heimdall as well, oh wait you’re just focusing on Loki for some mysterious reason and giving the others a pass lol), Asgard and Jotunheim were officially at war, and Loki was also king by Frigga’s decree.
It’s kind of an acknowledged fact by both Laufey and Odin that Thor showed up spoiling for a fight and intending to start conflict (i.e. “He’ll get what he came for… war, and death”). Is that just not factoring in when you’re busy blaming Loki for the breaking the treaty or?? So that one’s on Thor – and oh wait, therefore so is the shitfest it would have landed Asgard in. Funny how that works.
Loki’s stated purpose in obliterating Jotunheim was, among other things, to “[repair] the damage my brother has done” – ergo, prevent the war Thor started from resulting in that whole “horror and desolation” thing Odin was so upset about. There’s also that whole “[destroy] that race of monsters” thing, because surprise! Asgardians don’t consider frost giants to be people and also “I’ll hunt the monsters down and slay them all, just as you did, Father!” and “I am the monster parents tell their children about at night”, so unless we’re going to examine our own modern fictional narratives wherein it’s totally morally acceptable to destroy entire sapient alien races because they’re hostile/monsters, it’s a wee bit disingenuous to single this out as an obvious, clear example of Loki acting immorally. (Psst: also we might not want to ignore Thor’s outright stated intention of also genocide against the frost giants, and his intention to “finish them together” with Odin helping. Just a thought.)
As for Earth, lol at the idea that Asgard had a peace treaty with them. No leadership on Earth had any direct contact or traffic with Asgard that we’re aware of, therefore no treaty could exist, and in point of fact none is mentioned so I’m going to hazard that’s a really weird assumption on your part. Earth is spoken of as under Asgard’s protection, which appears to make them equivalent to a vassal state and therefore Asgard’s property. No treaty to break, just the idea that Asgard owns Earth being encroached upon.
Asgard also seems to be the Realm Police, America-style, given the whole Thor-has-to-go-to-all-the-other-realms-and-beat-shit-up-because-they-can’t-live-in-peace-or-prosperity-without-Asgard’s-intervention malarkey. Yeah, the Feudal Lord realm was cut off due to the broken Bifrost, so it ain’t that surprising that the other realms started jockeying for power with each other, and it makes them no more violent than Asgard routinely is.
So. Y’know. Can you maybe try to put Loki’s actions in cultural context? Seems easy enough for you to conceive of doing so with Odin’s.
LASTLY regarding Earth: name one piece of solid, in-movie evidence that Loki aided Thanos of his own free will, without coercion, solely to feed his own ambition, and that his fall through the void had no measurable psychological effect on him even though Word of God says it was extraordinarily traumatic and should have killed him. I’ll wait with popcorn, while I also use the time to collate my notes on all the instances which indicate the opposite.
“Loki did it all, knowing, knowing inside out that Odin was never going to approve”
Um what?
“To prove to Father that I am a worthy son! When he wakes, I will have saved his life, I will have destroyed that race of monsters, and I will be true heir to the throne!”
“A mere handful compared to the numbers Odin has taken himself”
Did you miss these also. Loki totally, honestly thought Odin would approve of his nuking Jotunheim – avoid Asgardian deaths, end the war, destroy the monsters, kill their traitorous king without any casualties. Loki showed extremely apt tactics that played to his strengths and would have enormously benefited Asgard at that point so like?? How are you getting that he knew Odin wouldn’t approve because. I’m having a hard time thinking of any issue Odin would take with that outcome when faced with the alternative of bloody conflict, unless a) Odin really did want to get him some killing on because he’s a warrior king, or b) Loki’s tactics might be considered inherently cowardly by the macho-ass Asgardian standard.
“but he believed it his birthright. Why? Because Loki, for all that we love his sharp tongue and his bullshit and issues—is the unreliable narrator of his own life. Cut me down if this shit isn’t true, seriously.”
…or because “both of you were born to be kings” maybe. Or you could investigate the oft-discussed and extremely compelling theory that Odin was grooming Loki to eventually be king of Jotunheim, which both explains the expectation of kingship that Loki was raised with despite paradoxically knowing he’d never be king of Asgard, and also why Odin maintained a bizarre peace treaty with a realm he’d conquered and crippled, and also also what he meant by intending to have Loki “bring about a lasting peace.”
Either way, it’s prettttttty disingenuous to paint Loki’s expectation of kingship birthright as either obviously misguided or a character flaw, when we’re shown on-screen that Odin perpetuated it in his childhood.
So “Loki … is the unreliable narrator of his own life” is a true statement; your application of it is really, really weak and unsupported by actual canon.
“Odin? No, not a great dad. But can he seriously be a dad in this scene when Loki has committed treason? Genocide? Attempted mass slavery of a peaceful planet that wasn’t even remotely prepared for war? No, in that case Odin had to be a king. And kings don’t tell their goddamn hard-fought and captured prisoners they were owed any sort of birthright relating to outright murder and slavery. As for the (Dark Elves) part, remember that was long before Odin.”
List of characters who committed treason over the course of ‘Thor’ and ‘Thor 2’:
Thor
Heimdall
Fandrel
Sif
Hogun
Volstagg
Loki
But no it totally makes sense for only Loki to be sentenced to eternity in prison. In fact, the only other person punished at all is Thor, and it served more as a moral lesson about not disobeying his father than it did an actual punishment for treason. Unequal application of justice is totally an indicator that Odin is being a responsible king and putting aside his feelings here.
Cool fact? If we’re not counting accompanying Thor to Jotunheim, Loki was the only one who didn’t commit treason in ‘Thor’, while the others all committed treason against him as Asgard’s lawful acting king, and also against Odin by disobeying Odin’s banishment decree. 😀
Re: genocide – see above for the example of Thor, and also see above for the example of conquering as a legitimate tactic used by Odin himself against other realms.
“As for the (Dark Elves) part, remember that was long before Odin. That was Bor, his father—and that was another war.”
Which Odin then related as a noble, just action and the morally correct course. Try again lol.
“How about—for a novel idea—we stop blaming Odin for all of Loki’s shortcomings?”
When someone starts actually doing that on this post we’ll come back to this.
“Because if Odin was half as shit a dad as we all want to believe, where the mouldy ass was Frigga during Loki’s upbringing? And how in god’s name did Thor come out okay?”
You have no idea whatsoever what parental dynamics look like when one parent is an awful person, do you? Because clearly if Frigga was a fine parent, Odin’s parenting would have no effect on his children.
Also: Thor didn’t “turn out okay,” he turned out a colossal ass who loves killing, attempted genocide, started a war, considered the entirety of Earth to be held of Asgard, and disobeyed the shit out of his father. Oh wait, that’s basically what Loki did also, except we’re not targeting Thor for it. Mysterious. I guess realizing that disobeying Odin was a bad idea and getting granted his magical hammer back in return clearly makes him so much a better person, and that’s why he tries to kill Iron Man and Captain America in a rage in ‘The Avengers’.
“Odin isn’t perfect. Not even close. But slapping abuse labels on him, expecting the soft compassion of a bleeding heart from the king of a warrior race, and expecting him to hug it out with his criminal son (sorry, did we forget the part where he also summarily disowned and kicked Thor off the entire planet without his powers for doing similar, where he would still remain if Loki hadn’t set him up to die) and then treating Odin like he’s some kind of demon? No. No, how about we let Loki own his crimes and then work upward from there.”
A+ missing the point of the entire meta post. Good job.
1) “[S]lapping abuse labels on him” is a pretty shitty thing to say when Odin’s behavior really does mirror real-life abusive parents, as stated by a notable swath of fandom who have personal experience therewith. You’re being gross.
2) Lol @ “soft compassion of a bleeding heart from the king of a warrior race” when you refuse to apply warrior-race context to anyone except Odin here lol I wonder why. Ain’t no one expecting bleeding hearts or compassion, just equitable treatment of people who commit the same or similar crimes, which Odin doesn’t, and the taking of Loki’s actions in any kind of actual context, which Odin doesn’t – and expecting Odin to avoid being literally needlessly cruel to someone he claims to love, which Odin definitely doesn’t. Because that line about Loki’s birthright? Was totally unnecessary for him to make as king, warrior race or not. He’s already sentencing Loki to life in prison; he isn’t trying to make him repent; he isn’t trying to make him “see reason.” That jab was cruelty, and additionally a tacit revoking of familial status, since Loki’s claim to a birthright of kingship is based on being a royal son of Asgard.
3) Loki didn’t set up anyone to die, ahaha. He lied to keep Thor on Earth so he could proceed with his plans to win Odin’s favor, which didn’t require killing Thor. He sent the Destroyer with orders to “make certain my brother does not return; destroy everything” and it didn’t even give Thor two glances until he made himself a deliberate target. Please see this post, which I’m already too long-winded to recap here.
“Because frankly, yes. Loki’s birthright was to die. We all read the deleted lines from the script, didn’t we? Laufey’s abandoned bastard. Picked up by Odin. A political tool? Sure. But the only reason Odin adopted the son of his former enemy as his own? Hardly. Odin could have Jon Snow’d that baby. Kings don’t often make sons of their war trophies. If Loki had a single moment of clarity, he might have realised that—and maybe the entire Thor MCU series would never have actually taken place.”
Translation: Odin didn’t allow Loki to die and instead chose to adopt him, therefore Loki has no right to resent any of Odin’s actions ever; also the fact that Odin’s political plans for Loki essentially required that Loki be extremely high-status in Asgard still surely can’t mean that adopting him was anything other than “soft compassion of a bleeding heart.” Ew. Hello textbook abusive dynamics. Perhaps the reason you think calling Odin abusive is ridiculous, is that you yourself see no issue with these dynamics. Ew again.
“In short, Odin ain’t your goddamn scapegoat for characterisation justification. Not in the MCU. He didn’t even get the damn on-screen chance to be the kind of bastard that could forge Loki.”
Translation: Loki exists in a void and no one else (least of all his parents) had anything to do with how he turned out, and also the scenes which indicate Odin did nothing to curb the blatant demonizing of frost giants in Loki’s own upbringing don’t matter and those scenes are in there for flavor obvs.
Additional translation: Only on-screen actions matter. This is why we don’t blame Loki for choosing to work with Thanos, given that it was never more than indirectly implied and not actually shown. Oh, wait.
IN CONCLUSION: Your response is a hot mess. Bye.
Please, go on…
Girls, what I’m going to say has almost nothing to do with Odin.
Loki is a psychopath, you have any doubt of it? He can’t feel regret or empathy…
Remember the guards he sacrificed in Thor when he let those jotuns enter the palace? Or when he didn’t doubt, not even for a second, on sending the Destroyer to Midgard? He doesn’t give a shit about people in general, except, of course, those of his own family (yes, psychos can consider their families, in fact, most of them have wives, kids and shit and they are also exemplar parents and husbands), maybe that’s the reason of why he didn’t kill Thor when he could or why his mother’s death torn him apart the way it did.
Psychopaths can have normal lives like any other normal person, unless SOMETHING, no matter how small and insignificant, makes explode the bomb that lives within them, cause that’s what they are, bombs. They are volatile, they are unstable…
Loki had a VERY important detonator: his jotun heritage.
There were many other things that helped, but that was the most important.
So, in my opinion, Odin was guilty and, at the same time, not.
If he was a good father? No, he wasn’t. The point is that he wasn’t a good father and his boy was a bomb, and no one saw that coming, not even Frigga… or Thor… or anyone else.
In resume, we have a mentally unstable boy, who has always been underrated, despised and compared with his elder brother by everyone… and then that one boy discovers his entire world has been built in a lie.
Everyone was guilty, people, but this doesn’t mean Loki is innocent. With mentally sickness or not, he made his own decisions; he could have faced his situation very differently, but he didn’t.
Come on! He’s brilliant! You are telling me he cannot discern between what is good and what is bad? No, girls. He directly doesn’t care, because regret is not in his nature.
I have just said it but I’m saying it again, to me he is a psychopath, he has a lot in common with that profile: he is brilliant, enchanting, a professional LIAR, he doesn’t regret anything at all…
Just my opinion and… if there is any grammatical mistake, I’m sorry. My first languaje is spanish.
I’m gonna really hope your continued use of “girls” as an address is a language thing and not meant to be demeaning. You’re addressing multiple people here, at least two of whom are adults (me & icy) and one of whom is nonbinary (also me).
I’m not going to get into full psychological reasons why I disagree strongly with your assessment of Loki as a psychopath, because interestingly enough, others have already done that. For my own part, I’ll just ask you to please not either equate evil acts with mental illness, or in the same breath insist that the very symptoms of mental illness that you’re describing have no effect on the moral gradient of those actions.
“He only acted that way because he was mentally ill! But he’s still completely responsible! He’s so smart, he couldn’t possibly not tell right from wrong, even though intelligence is not a factor in that because that’s not how things work!”
I’m not saying you should absolve someone of blame if they’re mentally ill; I’m questioning the fact that you’re using mental illness to excuse everyone else but him. I am mentally ill, and that is gross, particularly to those who actually have psychopathic disorders. In fact almost all of your language in regards to psychopathy is kind of gross and I would take a step back and maybe talk to some actually mentally ill people before you speak on the subject again.
To address slightly more specific points: sorry, cultural context negates the dead guards and the sending of the Destroyer to Midgard as signs of psychopathy. The guards weren’t certain to die and they were a low, expendable station – footsoldiers for a warlord. People on Midgard were humans and thus below Asgardians. Royalty in a feudal monarchy isn’t going to weep over serfs or storm troopers, and it doesn’t make them mentally ill. Can we. With feudal warlord cultural context.
It’s too early in the morning for this.
I’m sorry for the treatment, if my english vocabulary were wider, I would have used another examples and words. I’m not very comfortable writing like this and I didn’t try to excuse him. And yes, I keep thinking there were many people that weren’t very kind with him, you just have to watch the way Thor trates him in Thor, ordering him to shut up as if he were a lackey. Things like this, that to many people are insignificant, were like detonators to him. I didn’t try to excuse him for being a psycho (I do not change my mind about it), I just said that this feature makes him unstable, a bomb. But, well, his relationship with his pairs wasn’t what made him explode, it just added once the bomb already exploded. The most important reason was his discovering of being a jotun, a monster according with the asgadians. That made him go mad, absolutely. I’m not justificating him, I’m… analyzing him.
If you want better examples, how about the moment when he locked up his brother into that floating cage and threw it to the void? His own brother.
He’s dangerous, his actions unjustifiable…
And again, sorry for that “girls” treatment, I think it was just a bad traslation of the usual treatment we use in my country. We are very trustful, sometimes people from another countries say we are rude, but the truth is we are used to trate everyone with confidence no matter if the interlocutor is an adult or a totally strange. It was a mistake. Hehe. Sometimes I forget it’s considered rude. Sorry.
Your tags indicate you are not open to discussion at all, so I tentatively assume you came in with the popcorn image in order to be condescending and tell us that we’re missing what you consider to be obvious. I understand there is a language barrier here, so I will endeavor to be as clear as possible.
The way you describe psychopathy is offensive and incorrect. There are real-world people with disorders that include classic psychopathy, who will and can be hurt by this kind of opinion and attitude about it. You do not know what it is; your idea of it is skewed. You need to educate yourself further before you talk about it any more.
Saying that Loki could only have dropped Thor in the cage if he were mentally ill, is wrong and also harmful. I will repeat: I am mentally ill. Mentally ill people are not the only people who do violent crimes. Statistically, mentally ill people are more likely to be victims than perpetrators.
I appreciate and accept your apology on the use of “girls.” To clarify further, when you address an adult woman as “girl,” you imply that she is not an adult and that she is not to be listened to. It is dismissive. I hope this helps you to remember in the future why it is considered rude.
You did not excuse Loki on account of mental illness. What you did, was tell us he was mentally ill, and then say that because of this, his family’s actions towards him were insignificant and didn’t matter. This excuses his family for their wrongdoings and leaves all the blame on Loki himself. To treat someone you consider mentally ill in this fashion is horrible. Stop.
Loki is dangerous, and many of his actions are deplorable. The only lens through which they are unjustifiable is our own cultural lens, not the cultural lens of Asgard, where he grew up and learned all his morals.
Loki dropping Thor in the cage is about the same, morally, as Thor shoving Loki off the flying vehicle while he was handcuffed. Both knew the other would be fine, but it was still rude, and still looks horrifying because if they had done that to a human, the human would be dead. They are not human. They were fine. Loki knew Thor would walk away from that only inconvenienced, so it’s hardly a sign of mental illness.
If you are certain you will not change your opinion, do not come into a discussion like this. You cannot expect others to be flexible in their views when you refuse to be flexible in your own.
Thor gets mischaracterized a lot. So much so that a small part of me cringes whenever I see most of his portrayals. Even Marvel seems to flip around on his character in the movies but this is Marvel movies we are talking about and canon gets tossed around like a Chef’s salad often enough so..ANYWAY.
Admittedly, this alone could be my own interpretation but hey, I’ve spent two years trying to understand thsi character, and no I’m not talking about canon so much as I’m taling about how he’s often percevied. And lets be honest, that perception is not exactly positive.
Exhibit A, if you will.
Mythologically, Thor has changed over the years. Original Scandinavian mythology changed based on who wsa telling the story. And if you have ever tried to follow mythology canon, I pity you as it is utterly non-existant.
One of so so many versions.
So taking canon aside, what then is the point of my little essay? It’s because Thor is often reduced to the character of a brick wall. That being, he’s a mindless brute who fails helplessly in Midgard and can’t work simple devices like a toaster. When the polar opposite is true. Now I am not about to claim that Thor is some kind of genius here either, but he’s certainly a lot smarter than people want to give him credit for. Odin didn’t exactly do him any favours either. Training and raising him to be a war hungry brute and then dismissing him for that same exact reason.
A+ Parentling, All Father. (Imgur)
Again, well fucking done Odin. You can be assocaited with a few words. Hypocrite seems to be the best one. But I digress.
When we see Thor in Midgard..well..we get.
Sensless rambling.
Non-existant manners
A hilarious lack of understanding.
Apparently, these traits are enough to get him qualified under the ‘stupid’ blanket, when yet none of these choices make him dumb. They make him entitled but he was raised that way. He was raised to think he was the shit. He’s spoiled rotten, of course h’s going to apply that to Midgard, because it’s what he knows.
And no, this isn’t the best way to show intelligence, but the point is that he is. He knows well enough what he’s supposed to do. He knows about space, mythology and legends, He knows how to communicate on Midgard, he knows how to lead, and except for when his emotions are excaping him. he is a decent leader and a decent ruler.
There is a lot more to Thor than this. Thor not only learns his lesson, he learns it quickly and quickly enough to set things right He’s observant, and becomes more than aware of the fact that idol-worshipping Odin growing up probably wasn’t the best idea, If nothing else, Thor actually learns how utterly twisted he is.
He’s also worthy enough to lift Mjolnir in the first place. Which even the eptiome of all that is good Captain America can’t do. There has to be a reaon for that. And said reason isn’t. “wage endless war’ because if it was, Odin wouldn’t have cast Thor out for doing that.
Heck, just look at Mjolnir’s inscription:
“Whosoever holds this hammer, shall possess the power of Thor.”
That alone should make anyone aware that you need to have a very specific set of skills to hold the hammer in the first place. So far, Thor is shown to be one, and that has to be over more than just brute strength. Because strength alone doesn’t detrmine worthiness. Something even freaking Odin points out.
But! I hear you cry, Thor has to LEARN that worthiness!
Yes, yes he does, that is my point.
Stupid people don’t learn.
The ability to grow and mature is a sign alone of intelligence. Thor presents this multiple times. After all he learns to ignore the lessons that were once presented by his father, and discover what truly needs to be followed.
He learns that:
Brute Strength Isn’t Everything
How to Adapt to Midgardian Policies
How to Get Through to Loki (at even his darkest fucking moments)
What the True Meaning of Power Is
And many many more.
To characterize Thor as little more than the sreaming brute does him a disservice and negates his character. It doesn’t take into account thatl, like Loki he too had to understand that the very lessons he was taught for thousands of years were wrong and to move beyond them.
But why is it easy to forget that Thor learns things?
BECAUSE IT WAS FREAKING EDITED OUT OF THE MOVIE
You see this? This is a man who has been learning. A man who learned that this:
Isn’t the way to behave and makes up for it. And in three freaking days. He negates lessons and privilage drilled into his head for hundreds of years and makes up for it in DAYS.
He’s not just a brute that throws a hammer. He isn’t just your spoiled prince. He’s intelligent, quiick learning, forgiving and as multi-layered as any other character.
//I agree with all of this save one small nitpick: I don’t think Thor has QUITE reached the point, in film canon alone, where he understands Loki and has reached him psychologically and emotionally. I think he is ON THE CUSP of this.
I believe that the fact that he can see through Loki’s illusions is both literally and metaphorically significant. The place in The Dark World, when Loki tried to present Thor with a composed veil of illusion right after Frigga’s death, and Thor knew it was an illusion, and called Loki out on it, and Loki PERMITTED THOR TO SEE HIS REAL STATE OF TOTAL GRIEVING DISHEVELMENT, this was a major turning point in their relationship. And it showed Thor had learned better how to really see, acknowledge, observe his little brother.
I believe that the fact that Thor used strategic deceit to escape an Asgard under Dark Elf seige also proved that Thor had learned from Loki, who even was genuinely pleased, and confessed himself “impressed.”
I finally believe that when Thor kept Loki’s “dying” wish and told “Odin” that Loki had died heroically and would make a better king than Thor, and Loki HEARD this, it was a major step toward reaching Loki, and mending their sibling bond.
But I still think Thor has not quite reached Loki, in that he has not been willing to admit that Loki’s awful circumstances are not ENTIRELY Loki’s fault (”who put me there?!” “You know damn well who!”), which for Loki is a major point of frustration. Loki in film canon hasn’t bothered to tell Thor about Thanos, or how he was ill used in Thanos’s custody, because he doesn’t believe Thor will really listen. And as of right now, he might be right. Because Thor will have to overcome the test of learning that Loki killed their father, and Thor will likely see the secret ascension to the throne as selfish and opportunistic. This will probably cause a whole new rift between them in Ragnarok.
tl;dr your character analysis of Thor is super on-point and awesome and you know I agree. I’m just still worried that Thor’s character will be abused by the canon writing staff, to be less understanding and compassionate than he has been. But he’s VERY CLOSE to reaching Loki. You know our rp’s go way past that point.
icyxmischief 